Combining a Traditional Heating System with a Ductless Heating System (Podcast)

1 month ago

In this episode, John Maher speaks with Jared Grier, owner of Cape Cod Heat Pumps, about the advantages of integrating traditional heating systems with ductless heat pumps. Jared explains the concept of temperature and economic balance points and discusses when it’s beneficial to combine systems, such as for energy savings or access to rebates. He also highlights the challenges of integration, maintenance considerations, and offers a consultative approach to help homeowners determine the best fit for their needs. For more information, visit Cape Cod Heat Pumps.

John Maher: Hi, I am John Maher and I’m here today with Jared Grier, owner of Cape Cod Heat Pumps, an HVAC contractor in Marstons Mills, Massachusetts on Cape Cod, specializing in ductless heating and cooling technology and focused on detail, quality, and professionalism. Today our topic is combining traditional heating systems with a ductless heat pump. Welcome Jared.

Jared Grier: Great to be here, John.

Advantages of Combining Traditional Heat Systems with Ductless Heat Pumps

Maher: Yes. Jared, what are some of the advantages of combining a traditional maybe fossil fuel-based heating system and a ductless heat pump? And what do we mean by combining those things?

Grier: Yeah, so that’s a great question. So, when I talk to customers about heat pumps, there’s what I call two balance points we talk about. The balance point most customers know about with heat pumps, and this is really with the more traditional heat pumps is a temperature balance point. So basically considering that heat pumps the way they work is they move heat from outside and bring it inside, as it gets colder outside, the more traditional, and I’m not talking ductless or mini-splits, but the more traditional systems, they start to lose their capacity as it gets colder and they get to the point where they lose enough capacity that they wouldn’t be able to keep up. So that’s your typical temperature balance point.

With mini-split heat pumps and heat pumps in general, I like to talk about a different balance point, and I call it the economical balance point. So, the idea behind this is if you have a natural gas system, most of our customers have natural gas, don’t complain about their heating costs because it’s relatively inexpensive fuel, the systems are relatively efficient, so on and so forth. Oil, propane, much different conversation, right? So, take oil for example.

Oil when it’s warm out, my heat pump is more cost-effective to heat with because the house needs aren’t as high. It doesn’t need as much heat because it’s not so cold outside and there’s still plenty of heat in the air for that system to readily move into the house. But as the temperature continues to go down, now the house needs go up, there’s less heat available outside, so my system has to work harder.

When my system has to work harder, now it starts costing you a little bit more to operate. So, what an economical balance point is that temperature where a BTU out of your legacy existing heating system versus a BTU out of my heat pump, which is going to be more cost-effective. Now, depending on what your fuel source is, natural gas, it’s going to be probably between 40 and 50 degrees. Oil heat, it’s going to be between 20 and 30 and propane, it’s probably going to be between zero and 10 degrees. So, depending on what your existing fuel is, we might adjust those switch-over temperatures.

Is it Beneficial to Combine Two Heating Systems

Maher: Okay. So, talk a little bit about when it might be beneficial to combine or integrate the two systems and what are some of the factors involved in that decision?

Grier: Well, the big thing would be our customers that have natural gas, right? Because again, we’re generally not looking to increase customers’ utility costs. So, the customers that want to utilize the heat pump technology but maybe don’t necessarily want to cost them more to heat their home, but they maybe again want to use the heat pump some other times, that could be a very good option for those customers.

For some customers maybe they’ve got a newer, more efficient system and they want to add AC into the house, but they want to utilize the Mass Save program, doing integrated controls opens up that avenue to them. So, there’s various different reasons why customers might move this direction and we work with our customers and consult with them to figure out the best solution possible.

Challenges with Integrating Traditional Heating Systems with Heat Pumps

Maher: What are some of the challenges or drawbacks in your opinion when it comes to integrating a traditional system with a heat pump system?

Grier: Well, specifically we’re going to talk about mini-splits when I answer this question. The big thing would be integrating those in isn’t exactly easy right? Your traditional HVAC systems, whether it be wet heat, more traditional, conventional, forced air heat, they all work on 24-volt controls right? Your thermostat, that’s a 24-volt control. But in all reality, if you think about your thermostat, it’s a glorified light switch right? It’s turning your heating on, it’s turning your cooling on, but it’s just doing those things at temperatures right? Where my mini-split systems, the way they operate, they’re all communicating. So, the indoor unit’s talking to the outdoor unit, the thermostat’s talking to the indoor unit, which is also talking to the outdoor unit and they’re all passing information back and forth.

So, it’s not like I can just slap on a regular 24-volt thermostat and make that power up an existing heating zone. So, we have to add these separate device auxiliary read relay kits and things of that nature. We most likely have to change their thermostat to either a brand-specific thermostat or a dual-fuel thermostat. So, it certainly has its challenges with the extra material and labor needs to do it. And sometimes even though there’s incentives to go that route, sometimes that added cost can basically wipe out that rebate amount. So again, we’ll work with our customers, consult with them to figure out what best fits their needs.

Maintenance and Upkeep for Heating Systems

Maher: Can you talk a little bit about maintenance and upkeep requirements for systems, especially when you’re talking about potentially continuing to have your old fossil fuel system and now you’re also adding in this heat pump ductless system? Does that just make your maintenance and upkeep requirements and costs that much more because now you have two systems that you have to take care of?

Grier: Yeah, it could potentially make your maintenance costs higher. That said, this being New England, Cape Cod specifically, there’s plenty of people that have baseboard heat and then a ducted system for their AC. So, they already are used to having two different systems that they need to maintenance. So, I certainly wouldn’t make your decision purely based on the maintenance cost in the future.

But that said, they need maintenance just like any other mini split or heat pump system would maintenance. So just having us out once a year cleaning indoor coil, cleaning outdoor coil, drain pan tab, which check and drain, blowing out drain, checking operation, getting our Delta T’s, all that. So again, not much different.

Does it Make Sense to Replace Existing Fossil Fuel Systems?

Maher: And then finally, do you think that in a lot of cases it makes the most sense to just replace an existing fossil fuel system with a ductless heat pump system and just completely switch over to ductless technology?

Grier: We don’t advocate for any of our customers to do any specific thing. We take a very consultative approach when dealing with these projects with the customers. We analyze what their needs are, what their wants are, their desires are. We will ask if they have a budget in mind. We’re not necessarily getting down to a dollar amount, but we’ll ask about a budget. So really, we’re going to work with the customer to come up with the best solution that’s going to work for them in their home.

Maher: All right. But that’s really great information, Jared. Thanks again for speaking with me today.

Grier: Thanks, John.